Skyrim Memory Patch - fixing ILS, uGrids CTD, freezes

[Tuoni]

I'm using Skyrim Redone with the perk overhaul so I unchecked that perk flag right from the beginning in the Dance of Death MCM. As I said I can't be totally sure yet it's Dance of Death that causes the CTD's but I find it very suspicious that all the CTD's I have at the moment are whilst in combat and whilst having Dance of Death installed.

I doubt very much DoD is to blame in itself. First, it's an extremely popular mod so CTD issues in combat no less would have been reported a gazillion times by now. Also from persponal experience: I've been using it for a year now w/o any issues. Might be DoD in conjunction with something else rather.

Probably.
I don't have a way to reproduce the CTD whenever I want though. Sometimes it happens twice in thirty minutes another time not at all in two hours. This makes trouble shooting very difficult and it would take huge amount of time to deactivate all my mods one by one and play for two hours or more each time to see if the game will CTD or not.
Honestly I feel that DoD is not important enough to go through all that. I deactivated DoD and the game didn't CTD for three play sessions now so I'm more then happy to leave DoD out of my mod list.




Is it me or is the official SKSE memory patch bit confusing/complicated for the people who just look for the memory patch. Different names and different sizes, 768 is the new 512.

[nafeasonto]

I am going on a limb here and I really only looked at it for a minute, but the address TESV+c76b13 reported for the command in the crashdump is where tesv.exe usually stores data. For example start address and size of a allocated memblock. My debugger shows different data there, or different commands if you will.

I have not seen tesv doing anything like this just by itself even when I messed around badly with ini settings. But I suppose that could happen.

then minidump says this IP_ON_HEAP: 27d3002b
The fault address in not in any loaded module
Also, the stack unwind shows no external dll, but that assumption maybe wrong as it says.
So it doesn't point to any loaded dll as the culprit. Still could be the case. Just that the data it shows is wrong.

I do count SKSE including any SKSE plugin and ENB as mod. Those are the easiest to turn off for any further testing.

One could try checking with VMMap what is at that address, though that address might change each new run. So you'd need to have VMMap running before it crashes. And if VMMap sees whats there so should be the the minidump. The minidump most likely points in the wrong direction though.

okay so I will have VMMAP running, but does it only need to see TESV.EXE at startup? Or will it have to see TESV.exe before the crash? I can't really predict the crash. Is there an autorefresh so it can update the memory maps?

Or should that particular crash or memory map be there on start of the game?

[sheson]

@nafeasonto

Technically every dll and program is loaded when you are at the main menu. So VMMap should show it all when you choose or refresh tesv.exe then. Progressing in the game creates/removes memory allocations. You might want to look at the batch that keeps refreshing VMMap that was talked about earlier in this thread. So you have a current VMMap close to the crash. I wouldn't have high hopes this revealing anything useful. It might be more useful to find out how to force the crash and work through the setup by elimination.

[Bundy714]

I noticed several posts in this thread recently regarding Dance of Death, SSME, and AMD drivers, so thought I'd give my results.

I've got a heavily modded game with 209 esms/esps and had to merge 57 other esps to get down to the 209 that I'm using. I have a AMD HD7950 with 3gb of vram, an I5 with 8gb of system ram, running Win7/64.

Way too many mods to list but the ones that I assume are fairly stressful are OBIS, Skyrim Immersive Creatures, 8 of the Immersive Patrols series (left out bandits because of OBIS), Deadly Dragons, Deadly Combat, Dance of Death, High Level Enemies, Enhanced Enemy AI, Followers: Vilja, Hoth, Anduriel, Lovely Jessica, and Bijin Warmaidens, COT, RLO, Minty's Lightning, FrostFall, Get Snowy, Realistic Water II, Convenient Horses, Sounds of Skyrim, Enhanced Blood, Footprints, Vurts Flora Overhaul, Bellyaches new Dragons, Dual Sheath Redux, ABT tweaks, Touring Carriages, etc....etc....a ton of stuff, not to mention all the improved textures, Immersive Armor, Immersive weapons, Amidianborn everything, clothes for my companions, extra animations......you get the picture. Oh, and I'm using One Tweak so I can alt tab and run in borderless windowed mode. (and forgot to mention I'm using Falskaar, Wyrmstooth, and all the DLC)

I'm also using ENBoost without an ENB, instead I use SweetFX thru RadeonPro. And I used an earlier Phinix's tool to set my ENBlocal.ini, and I now notice that people say I have my Ram set waaay too low since it's set for a little less than the 3gb on my card.

Bottom line: I've run for at least 8 hours a day this week, and as much as 16 hours, with ONE CTD all week long. Sheson's Memory Logging Plugin says the highest memory usage has been 359/165 in my game. I'm also using SSME to implement the patch at the default 512/256 setting and ugrids of 5. It is the most stable game I've ever played. So, that's my info on Dance of Death, AMD drivers, and SSME. Maybe that helps someone.

BTW.....thanks Sheson, You DID fix Skyrim!

[Tuoni]

Not sure how much it matters but I'm on team green
I have two GeForce GTX TITAN in SLI.

I used both SSME and the fix as posted by Tase a while ago. I had combat related CTD's with both of them.
What is going on with SSME anyway? I don't hear anyone about crashes when it comes to the memory patch from Sheson/Tase/Uriel24 but the crash stories do seem to pop up with the crowed that uses SSME. What does SSME different that might/can cause CTD that the other patches don't?

[Bundy714]

.......What is going on with SSME anyway? I don't hear anyone about crashes when it comes to the memory patch from Sheson/Tase/Uriel24 but the crash stories do seem to pop up with the crowed that uses SSME. What does SSME different that might/can cause CTD that the other patches don't?

I use SSME, see the post above you, and I've had only one CTD in a week. IF I had to guess, I would imagine that because SSME is easier to implement, and because it's on the Nexus, that people using it are less experienced modders and they have other issues with their mods that are causing the CTD's. That's just a guess though. Either way, I've had absolutely no issues with SSME and crashes. The one crash I had was after playing for over 8 hours and I have not been able to reproduce it.

Edit: Played 12 hours straight today (yeah, I have no life) and no CTD's again. I will admit, that one CTD I got a couple days ago did freak me out, because....well, Skyrim NEVER crashes anymore. People having issues are going to need something other than AMD drivers, Dance of Death, and SSME to blame their crashes on.

[Daetarek]

.......What is going on with SSME anyway? I don't hear anyone about crashes when it comes to the memory patch from Sheson/Tase/Uriel24 but the crash stories do seem to pop up with the crowed that uses SSME. What does SSME different that might/can cause CTD that the other patches don't?

To answer the question above as far as I can see without learning assembly SSME uses a different method to achieve its goals whilst Skyrim loads (after all skyrim must execute first to then load the dll), whereas SKSE makse memory block changes prior to Skyrim loading, maybe there is something in that.

I actually like SSME and the idea behind it, being a separate file WHILST the SKSE team get together and add the patch to an official build, my understanding of what Queued has said was that it was never meant to be a permanent solution, just one to get people using the patch without having to build files, creating duplication of variant loader dll's and headaches for support purposes, due to SKSE rules of not distributing recompiled core files. I had a lot of issues even getting it to run to start with and Queued was extremely helpful, I like the guy and what he has done, that said....

I have had crashes and issues with SSME compared to the SKSE patch. It is important to note that I have issues with both if i run in 512/256 configuration, my memory peaks around 450 and 190, this seems to cause a crash, unsure why it happens all i know is that it does happen. I however have no issue on the SKSE loader with 768/512, and as a general rule SSME is also mostly fine.

I mentioned previously I see little point in covering all these issues in a post as people see it as bashing and then jump up and down and blame mods etc... , although the only thing that changes is the SSME or SKSE loader. But after 3 days of testing and investigation I am confident in my findings that the SKSE implementation is actually superior to the SSME implementation for me (IMPORTANT to note I say ME).

The problems I have are of course minor niggles to what we had in the past, and since there are multiple solutions I am happy just to use what works for me, I believe I am a member of a small percentage where SSME is a problem, I am fine with that and I do not expect any fixes for my issues, especially since I can use SKSE alpha fine without issue.

[Tuoni]

.......What is going on with SSME anyway? I don't hear anyone about crashes when it comes to the memory patch from Sheson/Tase/Uriel24 but the crash stories do seem to pop up with the crowed that uses SSME. What does SSME different that might/can cause CTD that the other patches don't?

To answer the question above as far as I can see without learning assembly SSME uses a different method to achieve its goals whilst Skyrim loads (after all skyrim must execute first to then load the dll), whereas SKSE makse memory block changes prior to Skyrim loading, maybe there is something in that.

I actually like SSME and the idea behind it, being a separate file WHILST the SKSE team get together and add the patch to an official build, my understanding of what Queued has said was that it was never meant to be a permanent solution, just one to get people using the patch without having to build files, creating duplication of variant loader dll's and headaches for support purposes, due to SKSE rules of not distributing recompiled core files. I had a lot of issues even getting it to run to start with and Queued was extremely helpful, I like the guy and what he has done, that said....

I have had crashes and issues with SSME compared to the SKSE patch. It is important to note that I have issues with both if i run in 512/256 configuration, my memory peaks around 450 and 190, this seems to cause a crash, unsure why it happens all i know is that it does happen. I however have no issue on the SKSE loader with 768/512, and as a general rule SSME is also mostly fine.

I mentioned previously I see little point in covering all these issues in a post as people see it as bashing and then jump up and down and blame mods etc... , although the only thing that changes is the SSME or SKSE loader. But after 3 days of testing and investigation I am confident in my findings that the SKSE implementation is actually superior to the SSME implementation for me (IMPORTANT to note I say ME).

The problems I have are of course minor niggles to what we had in the past, and since there are multiple solutions I am happy just to use what works for me, I believe I am a member of a small percentage where SSME is a problem, I am fine with that and I do not expect any fixes for my issues, especially since I can use SKSE alpha fine without issue.

Thanks for your answer.
For what it's worth; I think you could post your findings and thoughts about SSME vs. SKSE. I don't see the problem as long as the posts don't turn out in mindless bashing but that will be no problem for sure. What else do we have a forum for... just to throw flowers to each other and tell each other how wonderful and perfect everything is.. I think not!

People on this forum are intelligent enough to read the posts for what they are.
Well at least I haven't seen post on this forum like on other sites where people run 30+ spawning mods and uGrids at 15+ and then post to complain that the memory patch doesn't work because their game is still crashing... those people shouldn't be allowed to mod in the first place.

Maybe I will try SKSE alpha too... Just for experimental purposes as I don't have any issues (yet) with SSME.

[Daetarek]

Thanks for your answer.
For what it's worth; I think you could post your findings and thoughts about SSME vs. SKSE. I don't see the problem as long as the posts don't turn out in mindless bashing but that will be no problem for sure. What else do we have a forum for... just to throw flowers to each other and tell each other how wonderful and perfect everything is.. I think not!

People on this forum are intelligent enough to read the posts for what they are.
Well at least I haven't seen post on this forum like on other sites where people run 30+ spawning mods and uGrids at 15+ and then post to complain that the memory patch doesn't work because their game is still crashing... those people shouldn't be allowed to mod in the first place.

Maybe I will try SKSE alpha too... Just for experimental purposes as I don't have any issues (yet) with SSME.

Well to be honest I have tried typing it out a few times and I just cannot get what I want to say to come across correct without it sounding bad, the quick overview is many replicable load issues which only occur with SSME, but when I switch to SKSE no longer occur, especially loading after I die, I see some funny memory activity with it too when that happens, and some really odd AI problems, again happen with SSME but not SKSE and 100% replicable, these are not old saves but new games started these last few days for testing purposes.

Now with multiple working solutions I see little point in worrying about it, people should use what is best for them, I have spent most of the last 14 days testing the original patch, my variant, then SSME and now the SKSE alpha I just want to play the game lol.

One thing to keep in mind however is that as SKSE 1.7 becomes more stable and features are settled in it will most likely become a requirement for mods, for example many mods now already require skse version 1.06.16 or whatever it is, so I suggest people accept that is going to happen prepare and give the alpha a good solid go, make sure they configure it right (good guide here which includes the settings http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/50214/?) and if they have problems report it to the SKSE team instead of saying "alpha dont work for me just going back to SSME", most of the issues I have seen with people and the alpha is that the numbers and ini settings are different and people get stuck on that.

[nafeasonto]

This sucks got the crash again, and same error code, and a different address now pointing to the exception analysis. I wish I knew how to read dump files. Everytime it crashes it reads to a different address. I give up for now.

Not even 5 minutes of playing, I have no idea if it's one of my mods, probably is.