TES Skyrim 0.262

[jonwd7]

C'mon, i'll remove volumetric mist if will not get the results i'm waiting for.

I would test it out, but making anchors which show off the effect takes a very long time.

I also can no longer disable Mist by unchecking it. I can turn off Volumetric Mist, but normal Mist is always on. I used to be able to toggle Mist on and off without reloading the configuration. So I can no longer easily compare No Mist vs Mist vs Volumetric Mist.

Also, I am now getting an insane strobing/flashing effect. It appears to be caused by SSAO. It happens more often the higher the filter quality. "Use Complex Filter" it happens a lot, but turning it off and setting Filter Quality on Very Low, it only flashes every second or two.

I am uploading a video right now if it would help. It has not processed yet, so I am not positive the strobing effect will show up very well after encoding.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AcX6vQxeXY

First 0:15 shows I can no longer toggle Mist. Around 1:00 I increase the gamma to make the strobing more visible. Around 2:30 I start playing with the SSAO options and find out the frequency changes with filter quality.

[ENBSeries]

Opethfeldt
Don't think that you play with that sharp foggy look of the mist. Volumetric fog like that is different by lighting and opacity computation. I need similar results, but for the mist only, when it work like low frequency atmosphere effect.

jonwd7
I can't write copies of the shader for each combination of effects enabled/disabled (shaders are already 680 kb and very hard to browse them) and can't generate all possible combinations (this is for offline compilation only and the mod size may increase in 10+ times), so press "apply" button for all integer, boolean and quality parameters to recompile shaders with other definitions. This applies to your experiments with mist toggling and strobe from ambient occlusion.

[skysan4298]

Boris
I don't know how you made the mist to clump together like fog, but all I could produce
even at max density value was just haze. I changed the mist color to yellow to see if I can
see the outline, and maxed out the ExponentialFade value to limit the height of the
mist shooting up towards the sky from the anchor.
Here's a picture after tweaking all day trying to make mist like fog. The Skyrim weather
was sunny 81a, so I don't know if the mist logic needs the fog weather to render mist
like fog. Getting late here, so going to catch some sleep.

[jonwd7]

jonwd7
This applies to your experiments with mist toggling and strobe from ambient occlusion.

In 0.261, I had no SSAO strobing/flashing. Maybe you misunderstand, but I don't even have to open the ENB menu to get strobing/flashing. So your assessment that this has anything to do with my experimenting with values is incorrect. The strobing occurs the moment I start the game. It doesn't go away even if I Save and Apply my configuration. Also, I seem to be able to get some strobing while looking up at the sky with the horizon at the bottom of the camera frame even if SSAO is disabled. Again, none of this occurs in 0.261. I think it goes away in all cases if I toggle sky via console ("ts").

As for you removing the ability to toggle Mist without reapplying the config, I think it's kind of backwards. Toggling "EnableMist" should turn off both Mist and Volumetric Mist without a shader reload. Also, if you have EnableMist=true and EnableVolumetricMist=true when loading the game, then make EnableMist=false, then Save config, apply config, and still have EnableVolumetricMist=true, you still get all mist (both volumetric and not). If you then set EnableVolumetricMist=false, it will toggle off the volumetric mist in real time, yet the normal mist remains. This make no sense considering you already set EnableMist=false, and have now toggled off EnableVolumetricMist. If you're going to keep the current behavior like it is (EnableMist=false requires apply changes) maybe the EnableMist checkmark should be greyed out / forced checked if EnableVolumetricMist is checked.

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[Edit: Resolved]
While we're on the subject of mist, I assume you know about this issue with transparency? Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vsirgvi4vO8

... I understand the technical reasons for why such an artifact would exist, but I just wanted to verify it's a known behavior. I've noticed it since before 0.261, but I don't stalk the forums so I wouldn't know if it's ever been brought up before (so please don't berate me for asking).

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Anyway, I tried toying around with anchors for the Volumetric Mist:
http://imgur.com/a/shNFr#0

I definitely prefer the volumetric mist, but it takes a bit of effort adding lots of anchors. In the images above I've only placed about 15 anchors in a circle around Whiterun. I made the landscape very dark on purpose.

[Maeldun]

While we're on the subject of mist, I assume you know about this issue with transparency? Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vsirgvi4vO8

... I understand the technical reasons for why such an artifact would exist, but I just wanted to verify it's a known behavior. I've noticed it since before 0.261, but I don't stalk the forums so I wouldn't know if it's ever been brought up before (so please don't berate me for asking).

Yes, it's known. Boris has stated many times why he has not yet fixed this bug and why he will not do so until these volumetric effects are resolved.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2787&p=47654&hilit= ... ist#p47654
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2787&p=47078&hilit= ... ist#p47078

[jonwd7]

Yes, it's known. Boris has stated many times why he has not yet fixed this bug and why he will not do so until these volumetric effects are resolved.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2787&p=47654&hilit= ... ist#p47654
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2787&p=47078&hilit= ... ist#p47078

Thanks. I searched on Google using "mist transparency site:enbseries.enbdev.com" ... I'm guessing I would have found something if I used "fire" instead.

[Jafin16]

Just my quick two cents as I've only played with volumetric mist a little bit, but I think it's totally worth keeping. The issue, as has been pointed out, is the necessity of the anchors. It truly can look amazing but the extra work of adding the anchors (especially the potential need of 1000+) is a bit daunting for many people. Similar I think to how long it took before per weather settings got more wide acceptance. Even still, there are only a handful of presets that use the weathers, and that's because it's a lot of work. If you keep the feature, even if only a few here have posted results, it will become more widely accepted after it's optimized and more or less finalized. The potential is there, all of us are just trying to figure out the best way to make it work.

Anyways, I'll play around with it some today (I hope) and post what results I can. I've been a little swamped in "real life" lately so my time for modding has been more limited than anticipated (and of course it happens after undertaking a new project...)

[Aiyen]

To add to what Jarfin said:

Anchor deployment is a pain... it is very very tedious and will take a very long time. However once it is done then one preset will be shareable to all. As soon as "anchor presets" come up then it would most likely be used by just about all since then it would just be plug n tweak. At this this is better then weathers since you only need one set of settings instead of potentially hundreds.

Overall the point is.. if the tools are there then eventually someone with the time and insanity will go about doing it! It is clear that the vol. mist can produce a different visual experience over the regular...

On a side note
Boris: Would it not be possible for you to calculate a heightmap for the worldspace and export it? Then a utility to auto calculate the anchors based on height could be done. Would help to automate a big chunk of the tedious part and only leave the file adjustment up to people. For example say.. place only anchors at height X with an equal spacing Y across the entire world space.
Then I am sure some fancy math dudes could also implement other random functions to help adjust the distribution on a large scale.

[Oyama]

Sure, Volumetric Mist is a keeper, even if setting anchors is indeed a pain.
Also, no more ' strobe ' effect with the latest 0.262. All fine.

Keep it up, Boris !

[ENBSeries]

jonwd7

The strobing occurs the moment I start the game. It doesn't go away even if I Save and Apply my configuration.

Then it's not because of volumetric mist, i can't do this. The only code i changed is workaround for that TFC bug in previous version. Volumetric mist just use one more texture and one more matrix, it's other variables are same as for old mist, no separate drawing or anything like that, so i don't have any ideas what to start from to fix and don't have the issue at all. Share your config then and find out where this occur, if any dependency can be seen.
Issue with opacity for all transparent objects occur because mist computed from depth, but transparent objects are not drawed to depth (they can't). If i draw mist before transparent objects, then they all will be visible without mist (water too btw) at any distance, which is much more uglier bug than current. I wwrote various solutions in the time i worked with old mist, but no one implemented yet.

if you have EnableMist=true and EnableVolumetricMist=true when loading the game, then make EnableMist=false, then Save config, apply config, and still have EnableVolumetricMist=true, you still get all mist (both volumetric and not)

No, it is not right. Both mists can be enabled in config, but volumetric have higher priority and only it work then. I can move volumetric mist toggling under [MIST] category, but it's very different looking feature to place it there. Water have parallax parameters, but it's still flat water and player understand where to find parameters, but if he/she see something new in 3d space, where to find that?

but it takes a bit of effort adding lots of anchor

I placed 4 anchors at the corners of the world map at 0 level by Z axis, then it's the basement for any other manipulations.

Jafin16

especially the potential need of 1000+

Why so many anchors? I'm placing about 10 for entire valley of Whiterun and that's enough for mist or fog, even one cumulus cloud have similar size.

how long it took before per weather settings

There is no much work for per weather setting, because anchors are always the same for all weathers, only parameters in the enbseries.ini changes. This is done to make editing much more simple, too much work for unimportant effect.

Aiyen

Would it not be possible for you to calculate a heightmap for the worldspace and export it? Then a utility to auto calculate the anchors based on height could be done.

This will not work, anchors must not be placed on terrain by it's height everywhere. It's not the mist then, rather glowing mountains.

place only anchors at height X with an equal spacing Y across the entire world space.

For what reason? Only one anchor is enough to do that.